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Smokey Stover · Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2007 11:17 am Post subject: Who talks more, boys or girls?

I was listening to NPR today on the car radio, and there was a discussion of a new report from some respected organization saying that boys and men talk at least as much as women and girls.

The two discussants were the host of the program and a woman who had been studying or following similar topics for several years. She had read the report and pointed out several ways in which our common experience was misleading in regard to the amount of talking done by men and women.

She also brought up a study, made some years ago, that showed that teachers regularly called on boys more than on girls. According to this discussant, the report was followed by a change by many teachers, who now made a strong effort to call on girls as often as boys, 50-50 or close to it. A suprising result in some schools was that the boys complained of favoritism towards the girls, even though the teacher was trying to be even-handed. Apparently boys don't think even-handedness is fair to them.

Would anyone care to comment? Or must I provide not only the thread, but all the comments as well? You comment on my thread, I'll comment on yours. Okay, step right up and ring the bell.
_________________
According to Smokey,
Circumstances alter cases.

DurhamDawg · Sliver STAR Joined: 08 May 2006 Posts: 225

I think when girls and women are treated fairly, it's often viewed by men and boys as favoritism towards females. Males have been privileged for so long that in many cases their perspective is seriously skewed and they have an attitude of entitlement. I read an article recently that talked about how men being assertive in the workplace is seen as strong and competent, and they are rewarded with raises and promotions, while the same behavior in women is frowned upon, and they are punished for it -- by both men and women.

Smokey Stover · Posted: Sun Aug 12, 2007 2:18 am Post subject:

Smokey Stover · Posted: Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:50 pm Post subject:

I shouldn't be posting a reply to my own post, but I found a column in yesterday's newspaper by Ellen Goodman discussing precisely one of the topics that DDawg brought up, namely men raising their hands first in class. She also mentioned the canard that angry women are shrill bitches, while angry men are "righteous" (her word).

While we (you and I , Dawg) are on the subject of feminism, let's touch base on Larry Summers, erstwhile President of Harvard University, who allowed himself to say that one theory about the lack of presence of women in the sciences is their [and here the record gets murky]. He mentioned their lack of interest in science, and may have mentioned the theory that they had no aptitude for it. I saw a memorandum, copied by a lady who is an administrator at Princeton and attended the infamous session with Larry Summers. She took notes of what he said, verbatim, and joined the crowd calling for his lynching. She circulated copies of her notes, and I was able to read a copy. I could find nothing more anti-feminist than Summers' observation that "one theory is they have no aptitude..." It wasn't his theory, as he made plain.

As it happens, I was an acquaintance of Ernst Mayr, of whom the Harvard Gazette has this to say: "Ernst Mayr, the Harvard University evolutionary biologist who has been called the Darwin of the 20th century, died on Feb. 3 [2005]...." The article said much more, of course. When I talked with him I had no idea that he was one of possibly the ten most repected evolutionary biologists in the world. He was actually a very pleasant chap, with an attractive wife. He and I had a one-on-one conversation long years ago, when he was a fairly new Chairman of the Biology Department at Harvard. Without any previous conversation on the subject of women he launched into an explanation of what the hardest part of his job had been up till then. He wanted to get more women into Harvard's Biology Department, as undergraduate majors, as graduate students, and as faculty. He said the two biggest problems were: 1) the apparent lack of interest on the part of women students, and 2) a rather negative attitude on the part of many of the senior professors. They say, "The women come into the Department, get good grades or do astounding research, get married, and then disappear."

Take this as you will. I'm just the messenger. But I must point out that the President of Princeton University will not be accused of bad-mouthing women. The President IS a woman, formerly a Professor of Molecular Biology, and has announced that she will make every effort to get women interested in science and into the science programs at Princeton. The latter have multiplied somewhat since she became President. Two new labs and a new Science Library are soon to open.

The latter, the Science Library, will be run by Mrs. Stover. As though she didn't have enough to do, she's also Acting Head of Collection Development (i.e. acquisitions), and Acting Head of Reference Services. She didn't actually want those jobs, but because the two previous holders of the jobs have left town, she's one of only a handful of librarians who have supervised other librarians, and the only one who knows squat about Collection Development. So in she goes, along with her other duties, like Head of Sci/Tech Libraries, Assistant to the Deputy Head Librarian, Curator of Maps, Geosciences Librarian, and Chairman (Chairwoman? Chair?) of too many committees. She will stop being Acting Head when a permanent Head can be found. There are Headhunters hard at work (the Head Librarian says), so she may not have to do this a full year.

She's a workaholic, and likes to have enough work to do. When Harvard asked her, a few years ago, if she would like to apply for a job there as Geosciences Librarian, she asked: Is that all the Geosciences Librarian does there? Does he have any other duties or responsibilities? The answer was no, all the Geosciences Librarian does is run the Geosciences Library. So her answer was, Sorry, not interested. Not enough to do.

I have the feeling she may have bitten off more than she can gladly chew. I don't doubt that she can do it. But there are more problems now than, say, last year, because of the opening of the Science Library (which was designed by Frank Gehry, whose name you may know). I'm probably writing about her at such length because she is out of town, and I miss her. But I'm glad she's away, because she'll be so glad to get back. And I'm sorry to have nattered on for so long.
_________________
According to Smokey,
Circumstances alter cases.

DurhamDawg · Sliver STAR Joined: 08 May 2006 Posts: 225

men talk more, but women SAY more......

ReasoningFilly · Bronze Star Joined: 03 Feb 2007 Posts: 178

In this message board, women talk AND say more! Teehee!